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V-Due Carb
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steveknowles



Joined: 08 Feb 2009
Posts: 130
Location: Norfolk

PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2010 6:26 pm    Post subject: V-Due Carb Reply with quote

Put this on here 'cos there's not many of us on the Due bit of the forum. I've got a little bit of fuel leaking out of the carb into the airbox. Bikes been on the sidestand and the carb in question is on the lowside of the bike. Assume it's the float cut off not sealing. Any ideas anyone ? Haqve now put bike on paddock stand. also it has no fuel tap. Haven't posted for a while due to work/not having anything to report.

Steve Smile
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Jonny B Bad



Joined: 05 Dec 2009
Posts: 555
Location: NE London

PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2010 6:55 pm    Post subject: V-Due Reply with quote

Certainly sounds like a bit of muck in the float bowl preventing the float valve from closing completely. Make sure it hasn't flooded a cylinder BEFORE you start it, otherwise it'll trash the engine. Might be worth changing/fitting the/a fuel filter.
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steveknowles



Joined: 08 Feb 2009
Posts: 130
Location: Norfolk

PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2010 7:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, I'll take it apart and have a look. Hopefully it'll be obvious when I get in there
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oily



Joined: 05 Apr 2008
Posts: 4788
Location: worcestershire

PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2010 8:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What carbs are they Steve
And think yourself lucky you havent got four of um Laughing
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steveknowles



Joined: 08 Feb 2009
Posts: 130
Location: Norfolk

PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2010 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm pretty sure they're Dell Orto, have to admit to not having inspected closer, and yes I'm pleased there are only two. Think It's where it's been standing as much as anything, but will take the carb apart.
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oily



Joined: 05 Apr 2008
Posts: 4788
Location: worcestershire

PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2010 9:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Before you go to the bother of stripping it down, run it for five minutes, stop it for five minutes, run it for five minutes.....for a few times. Somtimes, you get a residue on the float valve seals and getting a flow of fuel through the valve washes it off.
You may be lucky, It's worked for me a few times Wink
As much as anything, it's a symptom of the modern, crap unleaded fuel we'er being sold Crying or Very sad
The ultimate cure for this common problem is to ride the tit's off it seven days a week Laughing
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steveknowles



Joined: 08 Feb 2009
Posts: 130
Location: Norfolk

PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2010 11:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for that I'll give it a go. Would love to be riding the tits off it but the shite weather has put a stop to that. Was having a great time "fettling" when I noticed the problem. I'd carbon fibre skinned a very knackered plastic v panel and repaired a broken mount on the fairing (previous owner was clearly very hamfisted !). Repaired fairing using Plastex, a fantastic product, actually does what the over enthusiastic American in the video says it does, I managed to replace a completely missing piece of fairing in no time flat. Also bought all new fairing bolts/fasteners from pro-bolt. Just ned torde it now. Ho Hum.
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oily



Joined: 05 Apr 2008
Posts: 4788
Location: worcestershire

PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2010 11:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How did your carbon skinning turn out
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steveknowles



Joined: 08 Feb 2009
Posts: 130
Location: Norfolk

PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 12:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very pleased with it actually. Pretty fiddly and something that would improve with practice. The carbon fibre matting is quite tricky to handle, but all in all a pleasing result and a lot cheaper than having a one off piece professionally made. They (carbonmods.com) suggest either polishing or lacquering for final finish. I opted for polishing, but may well go for the lacquer option as it looks better wet than dry.
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steveknowles



Joined: 08 Feb 2009
Posts: 130
Location: Norfolk

PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 8:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oily, top tip on the carb problem. ran the bike etc and the carb leak has stopped. Thanks for that
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oily



Joined: 05 Apr 2008
Posts: 4788
Location: worcestershire

PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 9:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No problem Steve, glad it worked for you.
Hoping for some good karma in return with this bloody 6R Laughing
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Jonny B Bad



Joined: 05 Dec 2009
Posts: 555
Location: NE London

PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2010 10:47 am    Post subject: 6R Reply with quote

Oily

Is your 6R still giving you gip? Looking back over old posts, I saw yours from when you first got the bike. You say that it came with 150 main jets as compared to 120s quoted by Bimota. The manual I've got actually quotes a mixture of 125s and 127.5s. I think the problem here is that for the most part the manual is a copy of the GSXR11 manual - I've seen both and its word for word. Rumours abound as to the extent of the mods made by Bimota, but we know that the airbox and pipe, at the very least, are different. So it's a fair bet that the jetting is different as well. What I can tell you, based on experience of 4 of them, is that they did indeed come with 150 mains as standard. It's important to remember here that Mikuni 150s are not the same as Dynojet 150s. The Mikunis have a single ring round the outside of the head of the jet.

Mine has got a freer flowing exhaust, so I've actually increased the size of the mains to 155s (Mikuni) and it fuels fine low down, as opposed to when I first got the bike when it felt like it was massively over-fuelling low down. This I put down to the pump, which I've disconnected and removed. There was a fix for the poor low down fuelling doing the rounds, which involved a bypass to channel excess fuel back through the pump rather than to the float bowls. I tried this first and it didn't work for me. So I tried disconnecting the pump altogether and it works fine. As I understand it, the pump was installed to address starvation at very high revs on the 6 and I guess they thought that would be even more accentuated with the ram-air on the R. Whether the pump would indeed make some contribution at high revs I don't know. However, I recently had no trouble staying with a spiritedly ridden Gixxer Thou and on the other hand the appalling fuelling that the pump gives low down is way too high a price to pay for what ever it may or may not be doing at the top end.

My advice would be to make sure you've got a clean air filter, junk the pump and re-fit the carbs with the 150 mains. As regards needles, I think I'm on the 2nd or third notch. Can't remember where my mixture screws are, but that's only really fine tuning, provided you can get it started. Float levels are very difficult to measure unless you're a tuning wizard and don't for god's sake try to adjust them, 'cause you'll probably end up having to buy new floats and valves, which is a fortune (voice of painful experience).

Hope this helps. I'd be keen to know how you get on.
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oily



Joined: 05 Apr 2008
Posts: 4788
Location: worcestershire

PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2010 11:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cheers for that JBB,
Where I'm at at the moment is........
After an awful lot of headaches, more than with all the bikes I've owned put together, I got it all sorted and running sweet as.
Started it up yesterday morning, running on 3 cylinders again.
In the early days I couldn't get it to do anything but tick over on full choke so obviously a major fuelling problem.
3 sets of carbs later, it ran, sort of, so off to the dyno we went. No fuel pump, clean air filter, new set of iridium plugs.
Bearing in mind we are now on GSXR carbs as opposed to Bimota needles and jets.
Got it up to 136.33 BWHP with 78.58 ftlbs.
Well as it hadn't/couldn't run for 18 months.
Came to start it 2 weeks later, no spark on all four plugs.
Into the bin with the new iridium plugs
In with a set of new , standard plugs, awesome, we're in business again.
Yesterday morning, firing on 3 Crying or Very sad
If it keeps on playing up, I'm gonna take a big hammer to it or a match.
Currently, the carbs were set up on the Dyno as follows:
165 main jets, pilots on 2.5 turns, gixxer needles on groove 5. All seems quite high but runs absolutely great (sometimes)
It's just these intermittent problems that keep reappearing........
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Jonny B Bad



Joined: 05 Dec 2009
Posts: 555
Location: NE London

PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2010 12:34 pm    Post subject: 6R Reply with quote

Oily, sorry to hear that it's still giving you grief. Where you are now sounds like where I was with another Bim (YB8) a wee while ago - could've happily put something I've loved for 20 yrs in the crusher!

Back to your 6R. First reaction, 165s are too big, what ever the Dyno says. Again, depends what we mean by 165s - Mikuni or Dynojet - they flow quite different amounts of fuel, because the number means something quite different in each case. In my experience new plugs can give the impression that the problem's solved, but if it's still over-fuelling they will deteriorate rapidly and you'll be back to square one before you know it. With the needles sitting so high, this will exacerbate the low down over-fuelling and accelerate the demise of the plugs.

Here's what I'd do (and it's worked for me 4 times). Check the 150 mains you had originally for the single ring round the outside of the head. If they have the ring they're Mikunis and either put them into the carbs you've now got on or go back to the original carbs, unless you've got reason to believe they've been mucked around with. However, if they still had what were the original mains in, i.e. Mikuni 150s, I doubt they had been monkied with so use them. I suspect that Bimota retained the original needles which I would return to groove 2. I should stick with original mixture screw setting of 2 turns out, as what ever Bimota did, it's unlikely to impact on idle and very low speed running.

I'd be very surprised if your 150 mains are not Mikunis, but if you haven't got the ring they're not. In which case, you can order them at very modest cost from Allens Performance 01949 836733.

Back to the air filter. Are you still running the original - i.e. a plain bit of sponge that looks like it should be keeping your battleship/duck/other company in the bath? Depending what state it's in, it might be flowing quite a lot of air which allowed you to get a respectable (albeit there's room for more - I'm getting 143)) figure on the Dyno, whilst lower down it's still significantly over-fuelling. ITG will make you one which flows just as well and probably better and will actually do a decent job of ensuring that nasties aren't getting through to grind your motor to smithereens.

Beyond that, are you running the original pipe? 150 mains are fine with that but, as I say, you can go to 155s with an aftermarket free flowing job. Come to think of it, the pipe would also contribute to your 137 versus my 143. At the end of the day, 6bhp can be the difference between calibration of 2 different Dynos and is irrelevant compared to getting the thing to the point where you can ride it on the road without wanting to aim for the nearest brick wall!

Give me a shout if I've forgotten anything. Keep the faith. You've got some big smiles to come when she's running right.
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steveknowles



Joined: 08 Feb 2009
Posts: 130
Location: Norfolk

PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2010 12:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What you boys need is a nice simple two stroke ! (ducks for cover). My question is, are you sure it's fuelling/air that's the problem and not ignition? Apologies if I'm being a twat.
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