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Newby (ish) now has a bike!
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welshlamb



Joined: 09 Mar 2011
Posts: 592
Location: South Wales , Nr. Abergavenny

PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2016 12:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Have you got round to weighing them again yet to see if the coating made any difference?


Sorry... forgot to weigh them but I suspect you are right that any difference would be minimal (plus the LiPo battery should put me firmly in the black at end of the rebuild)
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welshlamb



Joined: 09 Mar 2011
Posts: 592
Location: South Wales , Nr. Abergavenny

PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2016 12:39 am    Post subject: Bloody wheels! Reply with quote

When I was removing the rear wheel I noted that the axle need some bloody great thumps on a steel drift to remove. Without it there is no way it would come out. Looking at the components everything was clean but trying to refit it was clear that similar brute force would be needed to to get everything back together. The shaft will not pass through either of the end bearings OR the spacer tube assy.

This didn't seem right!

measuring the shaft it measures between 19.95 and 20mm.OD
The bearings appear to be the same ID and the 'spacer-tube' assembly maybe a couple of thou smaller (at least near the ends) (searching the forum I noted someone complaining of similar problem with DB1 wheel spacer whilst removing wheel bearings)



Now I have two questions
1) is this the original spacer tube?(steel tube with two alloy collar/washers at the ends) On other bikes I've had the spacer ID is a good size bigger than the shaft ID (its only there to keep grease in and shite out)



2) what should be the correct bearings in the wheel assy? These bearings are marked 'NTN' and '6004LU'. This is generic 20mm ID 42mm OD 12mm wide bearing (sounds right) so is problem the shaft dimensions(tolerances) or the shaft not being straight?)



Any help on either item would be GREATLY appreciated.
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deebee4



Joined: 08 Jan 2011
Posts: 266
Location: Netherlands

PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2016 8:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The spacers look original Bimota/Antera. So no strange things there.

Rings on the spacers are there for centering it into the wheel hub, to make refitting the spindle easier. Wheel bearings are sealed on both sides nowadays.

The bearings are Japanese NTN. Now that they're out of the wheel I would replace them with SKF bearings.
I always put new bearings in the deep freeze for a few hours and warm up the hub before refitting the new bearings. It will require a lot less force to get them in the hub, lengthening the bearings' life span... Always apply pressure force on the outer ring, never on the inner ring. Most of the time I use a socket that fits into the bearings' hole with around 1 mm play.
Should the new bearing get stuck crooked, don't hammer it further in. It will make things a lot worse. Take it out, remove any burrs, clean out the bearing hole an try again. Patience will pay off.

About wheel spindles: These don't have to be a very tight fit in the bearings and spacers (as they sometimes are). The spindles are only there for tightening everything (wheel and chain wheel bearings, spacers in the wheel and spacers outside the wheel) into a tight assembly.

I usually clean and polish the wheel spindles so that they slide nicely into the bearings. Of course without noticeable play. Loads are distributed over the bearings and spacers to the fork legs or swing arm.

Look at the racing teams changing wheels on track. They practically can throw the wheel spindles in, no hammering.

If you have to hammer a wheel spindle into the wheel this is a sign that either something's out off true or the tolerances are too tight.

Just clean, remove any burrs and polish and make it slide in nicely. Next time the refitting will be much easier.

Smile
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welshlamb



Joined: 09 Mar 2011
Posts: 592
Location: South Wales , Nr. Abergavenny

PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2016 10:33 pm    Post subject: spindle Reply with quote

cheers Deebee

I have ordered new bearings and will try to polish the spindle with very fine wet and dry paper to get a ' push and slide' fit . Will also check spindle for straightness using granite worktop in kitchen (while wife is at work of course)

I still think though that the wheel bearing spacer design is very poor though as they should have designed it with 1-2mm bigger diameter internally. I guess at Bimota the good guys would be designing exhausts and frames so this was probably designed by a summer placement student (who failed his exams!).
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deebee4



Joined: 08 Jan 2011
Posts: 266
Location: Netherlands

PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2016 11:12 pm    Post subject: Re: spindle Reply with quote

welshlamb wrote:
cheers Deebee

I have ordered new bearings and will try to polish the spindle with very fine wet and dry paper to get a ' push and slide' fit . Will also check spindle for straightness using granite worktop in kitchen (while wife is at work of course)

I still think though that the wheel bearing spacer design is very poor though as they should have designed it with 1-2mm bigger diameter internally. I guess at Bimota the good guys would be designing exhausts and frames so this was probably designed by a summer placement student (who failed his exams!).


Sanding the spindle with sand paper may be overdone. First try how tight the spindle slides in the bearings (when fitted in the hub). Just polish it up with good metal polish to a shiny finish (not sparkling shiny). And then check again.

Spacers in Marchesini wheels definitely are nicely made from alloy, but the steel spacers with aluminium rings will do as well. But you might get a new spacer made now you've got the dimensions. Also you might check the dimensions within the wheel too, never know if they were a bit off.....

Wow: looking at the bearing more closely I can read the letters AIWAN...... Embarassed Embarassed
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welshlamb



Joined: 09 Mar 2011
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Location: South Wales , Nr. Abergavenny

PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2016 11:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not to worry, replacements will be SKF! . To be fair Taiwan engineering has improved dramatically over last 15 years ( I worked in Machine tool industry for a while) but I'd rather go SKF or FAG given the choice.
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welshlamb



Joined: 09 Mar 2011
Posts: 592
Location: South Wales , Nr. Abergavenny

PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2016 11:50 pm    Post subject: back from the cold! Reply with quote

apologies for lack of posts. progress has been made but not enough time to post it up. Well new rear wheel bearings and sanding/polishing of rear spindle helped but it was still sticking on the cush drive. I think it was not sitting squarely but once everything back on and torqued up the it all spun very freely.



With a clean up of the wheel and disc and fresh fasteners it was all looking better at the rear end. Thanks to Speedmade in USA I also now had a bracket for the rear shock reservoir and fitted that.

Unfortunately the rear brake wasn't playing ball! The pistons, if not actually seized, were VERY reluctant to move and all my engineering prowess (crowbars) were needed to get them back. and free the pads .



Although I had fresh (Galfer) pads the cost of a service kit and pistons plus the work got me searching for a new P32b caliper. Luckily they were also used upto early 2000s on V11 Guzzis and early RSV100 Aprilias which widens the field a bit. I managed to secure an RSV NOS unit for £55 from Germany. It has later branding than the original but it was all sparkly and ready to go after the pad swap. Result!



With the wheel fitted I could get the new (non O ring!) chain fitted and then covered up it all with a CF sprocket cover and refitted the refurbed rear hugger . The eagle eyed amongst you will note that several incorrect fasteners have now been replaced with more suitable items (eg.footrest hangars and linkages etc). Starting to look cared for again!



more to follow
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Last edited by welshlamb on Mon Mar 28, 2016 10:31 am; edited 2 times in total
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welshlamb



Joined: 09 Mar 2011
Posts: 592
Location: South Wales , Nr. Abergavenny

PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 12:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

On the other side of the bike I had the timing belt and clutch covers off for a clean and inspection.


No wear marks on the inside of the belt covers and the belts still had all the white markings in place so vendors assurance they had just been changed rings true.



The clutch also seemed clean, no dust, no loose fasteners. so just put cover back on with some new SS screws.


I did notice that the clutch basket is red... (not original?) The pressure plate etc looks standard. At some point I would like a billet basket and alloy plates to reduce inertia ( and noise) but for now it can wait.
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deebee4



Joined: 08 Jan 2011
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Location: Netherlands

PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 10:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice job! Also like the polished rims.

The clutch basket being red it looks to me that it has already been replaced by a billet item. So that's nice. Just hope they didn't use the steel friction plates, because these will hammer in the alloy basket quite fast. That's where the Ducati clutch noise comes from...
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welshlamb



Joined: 09 Mar 2011
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Location: South Wales , Nr. Abergavenny

PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 10:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Also like the polished rims.


Thanks and..... yes, it lightens up the 'elephant grey' look and blends in with the billet alloy brackets elsewhere
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welshlamb



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Location: South Wales , Nr. Abergavenny

PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 10:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Next job was extending the heat shield. Made a cardboard template first then cut some 0.9mm stainless sheet and then used same heat shield material I used on tank bottom. Should do a better job than the original 2 piece design. Covers up almost all the exhaust up to the cans themselves and nice and rigid.






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welshlamb



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Location: South Wales , Nr. Abergavenny

PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 11:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

With the rear finished I was able to drop the rear and get the front end up and remove the front wheel. The brakes looked and felt fine so just a pad change (cast iron friendly Galfers again).

The main reason for getting the wheel out was to check the front discs. These can get very rattly and loose on the buttons due to carrier wear. The core issue was poor material choice for the carrier (too soft) but slack tolerances and excess movement accelerate the problem.



The button circlip has a wave washer under it and over time these flatten, allowing free lateral movement of the disc. Unfortunately 14mm ID is not a DIN standard washer size and I've not been able to source replacements (the same issue crops up on Ducati and Laverda forums as well as they all have fitted the 12 button cast iron discs at some point). replacing carriers or whole discs is ££££)

Browsing ebay a few weeks ago I saw some 14mm wave washers on sale in Hong Kong. At £3.60 (incl postage!) I thought it worth a try but suspected a scam and not to see my order turn up.

To my amazement they turned up (via Germany) 8 days after ordering. They are identical thickness to the old washers but about 0.5mm greater ID and OD (14.5 and 21.5mm).

The photo below shows the old and new wave washers (although the original can hardly be described as that any more!)



With all the washers replaced there is NO free movement (but the washers will still allow for thermal movement) and NO rattles!

I chased out the disc retaining bolt holes and replaced with new items from BCP. (note that BCP supplied 30mm versus original 20mm. There is enough width in the hub to accommodate but the bolt holes do need chasing out with a thread tap to allow fitment)

With the wheels cleaned and discs rebolted (plus some bling rim stickers I had seen on 2Bims bike and sold on Ebay) the wheel was ready for refitting.


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2bims



Joined: 03 Apr 2010
Posts: 7289

PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

all looking nice and meticulous and either back to proper or improvement on original..........I dont know whether people with OCD seek out Bimotas or whether owning a Bimota brings out the OCD in people....either way its clearly there.........

And on that front.....I'm digging your funky reverse gear change set up...is your left foot on backwards? I didnt notice you walking funny when I met you Lambie?

My gear linkage rod is on the underside of the peg...as opposed to above like standard....but mine came like that together with a groove in the fairing edge where it had rubbed itself a "clear run" over the previous years of ownership....You'll probably find that the rod rubs on the fairing after fitment if you intend to keep it that way...

Crinkle washers?...I hope that your photo is purely for "display" purposes only...and that you havent fitted them behind the alloy carrier where it bolts to the wheel hub?

Only other bit is.......Split pin on the chain.......Now theres a brave man.....Arent they an MOT Fail nowadays or is that just a rumour I heard?
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welshlamb



Joined: 09 Mar 2011
Posts: 592
Location: South Wales , Nr. Abergavenny

PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 12:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Before I can get the bike MOT'd and registered I need an MPH speedo. The one I found had 20k miles on the odometer (twice the 'real' mileage on the Km original). The 20k miles will be the figure shown on UK registration/test documents so I thought I had better take a photo for my records. [trying to get a 'low mileage' speedo for a 20 year old bike is in any case difficult!)



After a lot of searching I found a source for a '3D' instrument cover like 2Bims used on his restoration.
The original source via Kaemna in Germany had well and truly dried up as the guy that made them had died.
I got mine via an Italian bike shop in Germany but now I have the part I can see the manufacturer http://www.aviacompositi.it/en/carbonio/ducati/ss-888-851.html and that the direct price from the manufacturer's online shop is €89 (£70)

All straightforward (if a bit fiddly) to fit and all covered in 2Bims thread so I won't bother here.





End result is a much nicer appearance. I just had time to refit the airbox and the LiPo battery (doesn't even feel like its measured 1kg when you handle it) before dinner called me away from the garage

[/img]
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2bims



Joined: 03 Apr 2010
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 12:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeh...they are a bit fiddly to fit...complete removal of clocks...with headlight first...then dials out of unit...and then refit all....but they do cover up the ageing grey foam...and fitting under the clocks its once fitted forget...and with the wrap around carbon its a true professional fit and finish that the flat carbon units that just tape and flop onto the unit just dont come anyway near in finish and quality
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