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ignition (or fuel) problems, some suggestions please
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shay001



Joined: 23 Sep 2016
Posts: 80
Location: Trunkey Creek, NSW Australia

PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 8:26 am    Post subject: ignition (or fuel) problems, some suggestions please Reply with quote

Hi guys,
As you know my poor DB1 has not had the best of lives, being somewhat abused (not by me, by previous unknown users, esp the clown I bought it off)
Little by little I was taking it back to former glory, the carby setup has been a pain but finally, when warm (50+) it idles, does not idle cold and runs well through all carb openings. was pulling 6000+ in lower gears with no hint of trouble

At least it did, took it for a test ride today and it ran beautifully, but after a while a bit of a backfire was occurring (quick closing of the throttle) and a reluctance to go above 5K in 5th gear. Thought it might be fuel (at a refill was nearly 15L) as I have been riding it to get it hot to set the carbs off and on I was not keeping track of economy, I'm still not.

Anyway, after the refill it started with just the slightest touch of the button, idled at about 1200 and setting off again seemed ok, I was not going that hard though. Again, not able to take it past maybe half throttle, and after about 15kms after the refill the battery light came on.

It's still cooling as a write this. My own thoughts are that I have an ignition, not a fuel problem Any thoughts or suggestions most welcome
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brian



Joined: 22 Aug 2011
Posts: 3769
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 11:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hard to tell really. Does sound like it may be spark (or lack there of) related. Have you tried changing the plugs? I fouled a few sets of plugs whilst trouble shooting my DB4
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'99 DB4 #104, '96 SB6 #1165, '94 DB2 J #652, '99 DB4 #088, '08 VTX1800, '93 ZXR750R M1, '95 ZXR750, '95 ZXR750 Race Bike, '94 CBR400rr NC29 Race Bike, '94 CB250, '49 BSA C10 250, '61 BSA A10 650, '89 ZXR750, '91 Ducati 851
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shay001



Joined: 23 Sep 2016
Posts: 80
Location: Trunkey Creek, NSW Australia

PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 11:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

well, here is the funny part, just went out and started it, started easily from cold, the battery light went OUT as it is supposed to, so I think I am dealing with 2 faults, one being fuel starvation and the other being a connection in the charging circuit that expands under heat and goes loose.

Little beast was going like a rocket before the fun started.
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Gavin944888



Joined: 29 Jan 2014
Posts: 572
Location: Essex....way South of Scotland

PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 12:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shay001,
Sounds to me like electrical...especially if you experienced difficulty in revving through the problem
I had a similar issue ...charging light on off voltage indicator low then normal and running like it was almost out of fuel
If this all sound familiar chech your earthings and especially your reg and coil earths.
....as you say...it is either fuel or spark and you have enough fuel!

I hope that this helps
Regards
Gavin
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shay001



Joined: 23 Sep 2016
Posts: 80
Location: Trunkey Creek, NSW Australia

PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 1:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yes, I'll check it out Monday as I will be working tomorrow. The strange behaviour happened well before the battery light came on, I was going to check all connections on the reg and earths as suggested, I already cleaned to coil contacts, I'll just make sure that they are not slightly loose.

Bummer really, as it was going well until then, climbed up slopes well, without losing power (as it was on the way home, totally gutless) and all the rest of the early part of the trip was tight corners which it handled in the way you would expect, and seemed quite happy to rev too.

I was thinking that maybe, just maybe the regulator is breaking down internally under heat, it did get to maybe 98 deg during the ride.
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mick



Joined: 10 May 2015
Posts: 48

PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 5:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I owned a DB1 for 22years in that time i once had a problem with fuel starvation,I had changed the fuel lines including the lines that operate the vacuum fuel pump. When the engine was hot the vacuum lines lines couldn't stand the temperature and partially collapsed under hard suction.
I also had a misfire which was caused by one of the chokes not seating properly.
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shay001



Joined: 23 Sep 2016
Posts: 80
Location: Trunkey Creek, NSW Australia

PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 3:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks for your input but I have conventional fuel taps. The provenance of this bike is somewhat murky.
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kenmoore



Joined: 22 Apr 2016
Posts: 159
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 8:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Long shot,

Check the vac hoses from the inlet manifolds.

Similar problem with another bike , the brand of which I am not prepared to mention on here.

Cheers
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DB1 860



Joined: 23 Mar 2014
Posts: 177
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 10:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Something worth trying is releasing the fuel cap when the problem occurs,
the breather hose/ valve for the tank can block up,
It happened to me, I disconnected the whole system, no probs since then
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shay001



Joined: 23 Sep 2016
Posts: 80
Location: Trunkey Creek, NSW Australia

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 5:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks for all the help guys, here is the causes of the problems which some of you may find handy to put in your fault finding lists should you ever (god forbid) have similar problems.

The fuel starvation was caused by the fuel baffle sponge disintegrating due to old age, blocking the inline filters.

The regulator may in fact be faulty, but before I consider replacement I have to replace the cable from the alternator to the reg. This has been subjected to years of heat and the insulation is more like powder than plastic.
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brian



Joined: 22 Aug 2011
Posts: 3769
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 8:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glad you are getting it sorted
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'99 DB4 #104, '96 SB6 #1165, '94 DB2 J #652, '99 DB4 #088, '08 VTX1800, '93 ZXR750R M1, '95 ZXR750, '95 ZXR750 Race Bike, '94 CBR400rr NC29 Race Bike, '94 CB250, '49 BSA C10 250, '61 BSA A10 650, '89 ZXR750, '91 Ducati 851
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shay001



Joined: 23 Sep 2016
Posts: 80
Location: Trunkey Creek, NSW Australia

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 1:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yeah, have to get it running well for March, it may not be the prettiest or most pristine, so it has to run right.

Plus, I just love riding it, and my good friend who is mostly into them thar adventure bikes (and has only ever ridden 2 sport bikes, the DB1 and my 848 Evo) is adamant that the DB1 is the superior machine.
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DB1 860



Joined: 23 Mar 2014
Posts: 177
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 10:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I always wanted to know if those sponges in the tank start to break down over time.

Have you run one of those ethanol blended fuels in your bike at some time?
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shay001



Joined: 23 Sep 2016
Posts: 80
Location: Trunkey Creek, NSW Australia

PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2017 3:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have no idea what's been put in this bike before, as I have stated, it has not had the easiest of lives, the guy I bought it off seemed about ready to do "an insurance job" on it.

Mike from Gowanlochs suggested I look at the sponge, he has had a bike in the workshop suffer from the same problem. This was with an ex race bike. I am assuming that many things subjected to fuels long enough are going to break down. I have done some research and can find nothing on the longevity of this sponge.
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brian



Joined: 22 Aug 2011
Posts: 3769
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Sat Jan 21, 2017 9:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

shay001 wrote:
yeah, have to get it running well for March, it may not be the prettiest or most pristine, so it has to run right.


You going to the BSFoS shay?
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'99 DB4 #104, '96 SB6 #1165, '94 DB2 J #652, '99 DB4 #088, '08 VTX1800, '93 ZXR750R M1, '95 ZXR750, '95 ZXR750 Race Bike, '94 CBR400rr NC29 Race Bike, '94 CB250, '49 BSA C10 250, '61 BSA A10 650, '89 ZXR750, '91 Ducati 851
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