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Questions for YB6 EXUP / YB8 owners
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Andrew034



Joined: 02 Apr 2017
Posts: 13
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Thu Jul 06, 2017 10:56 am    Post subject: Questions for YB6 EXUP / YB8 owners Reply with quote

Hi all,

I bought the Furano that was sold at the last auction in Las Vegas, after several months wait it is now in my garage here in Australia.

It's been many years since I was near an EXUP Yamaha so I have a question on the EXUP and another couple on the fuel injection too.

After receiving the bike I began reviving it and preparing it for local (Australian) road use. The fliuds have been replaced and after surprisingly little coaxing it started an ran (not ridden it yet though).

Some sleuthing has determined that while the bike may be a 1992 model, the Yamaha engine dates from 1990 (I guess Bimota had a big engine delivery that took years to sell)

Now here are the questions:

From my memory the EXUP servo should cycle when the ignition is turned on, mine doesn't. I removed the servo and it checks out fine (it works). The exhaust valve was stuck, but I've now fixed that too. However, so far the servo doesn't show any signs of life when connected to the Yamaha ECU.

If the servo is OK it may be the ECU, therefore are the various FZR1000 ECU's interchangeable?

Any opinions in the hall of experience?

Secondly, the fuel pump is spraying fuel throughout the tank (not the hoses they are OK) and there is no fuel coming out of the fuel regulator return. Notwithstanding, my trusty fuel pressure gauge lists exactly 3bar of pressure when the pump is running. Therefore I have the correct fuel pressure.

So does an early fuel pump have an internal relief valve? Can anybody else tell me if their machines are the same.

Finally what does everybody use to talk to the P7 ECU? I have an old copy of VDSTS that I use on my Ducati's but I think it stops at the P8 ECU.

More will come to me later

Thanks

Andrew...
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Bud977



Joined: 03 Mar 2013
Posts: 324
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Thu Jul 06, 2017 9:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Andrew, I'm a YB8 owner in Sydney but I'm afraid I can't help you. My YB8 is a carby version and my pipe doesn't have an EXUP valve. An injected FZR motor would be a rare thing locally.

Hopefully you will get some answers on this forum. Otherwise, you could take it to C&M Motorcycles at Ingleburn. Craig at C&M knows FZR1000s backwards and supplies Ignitech ignitions that may be used if your ECU is kaput.
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Jonny B Bad



Joined: 05 Dec 2009
Posts: 364
Location: NE London

PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:06 am    Post subject: Furano Reply with quote

Hello Andrew

I've got a YB8 and I don't believe the exup servo cycles on start-up. Does it start to open the valve when you rev the motor?
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What, Jonny's gone!
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who



Joined: 10 Nov 2010
Posts: 297
Location: Melbourne Australia

PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 4:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Look up Bimotabob, on the members list here. He has sold his Furano, but knew more about injection and such things than most. Look him up.
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who



Joined: 10 Nov 2010
Posts: 297
Location: Melbourne Australia

PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2017 7:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bud977 wrote:
An injected FZR motor would be a rare thing locally.


Not that rare Smile


Last edited by who on Mon Jul 17, 2017 8:33 am; edited 1 time in total
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Bud977



Joined: 03 Mar 2013
Posts: 324
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2017 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Correction. I see they've become common as Hondas now Wink Smile

Is that a new purchase?
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trev45



Joined: 15 Jun 2011
Posts: 352
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 12:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No but I know where it came from Wink

Cheers Trev
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who



Joined: 10 Nov 2010
Posts: 297
Location: Melbourne Australia

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 4:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Trev, Yes I have Gregby to thank for that one... she's a thing of beauty, and number 69.

I've got the necessary bits to build a second injected race bike as well... zoom zoom Very Happy
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Andrew034



Joined: 02 Apr 2017
Posts: 13
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 2:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What is it? The only fuel injected YB6 I'm aware of is the Tutuara.
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who



Joined: 10 Nov 2010
Posts: 297
Location: Melbourne Australia

PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 9:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Andrew, you may be aware of the dispute over how many Tuatara were made, some say 76, others say 80. Four 1988 YB6 EI's were made for the Japanese market, and first displayed at the Tokyo motor show.

Essentially a Tuatara, but with the "better" Marzocchi conventional forks, and non digital instrument cluster.

I'd post a picture of the Tokyo stand in 88, but photofucket has taken away the great privilege it was to navigate the pop ups and other crap on their site in exchange for 400 US annually.

I also have the sales brochure from 1988 which was 4300000 yen, which is about 48,000 Au dollars today... Rolling Eyes

As far as I am aware there was only the four of them
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Andrew034



Joined: 02 Apr 2017
Posts: 13
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Sun Jul 16, 2017 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Getting back to the original questions:

The Furano is running, but rather rich - I don't have a CO meter anymore but since my eyes water while the engine is running it is a fair indication.

There are two items, firstly the Fuel Pressure is steady at 4 bar and the TPS was set to 650mV (at idle).

According to the Weber Marelli literature the fuel pressure should be 3 bar and the TPS 150mV at Zero throttle (about 250mV at idle).

I took the TPS out and it is Colvern CP17/707, the minimum resistance is 1.85k across a span of 4.7k. My point is this TPS is never going to give a reading of 150mV.

bimotabob has already noted similar figures for his TPS and additionally noted that the ECU is an IAW041 (rather than an IAW 043 as per a Ducati and Moto Guzzi).

I moved the TPS to the minimum setting, and on re-assembly the bike simply refused to run cleanly at any setting other than 650mV (so I guess one of the differences with the IAW 043 is the TBS values).

So my requests are as follows:
1. As the same TPS is used on the YB4 and Furano (and I guess the YB6 Tuatara and YB8e), does anybody know what TPS is the OEM ones? (or is mine the correct one)
2. Does anybody have access to a workshop manual for a fuel injected YB4, YB6 or YB8. Specifically, setting up the TPS and fuel pressures (it is clearly different to the Ducati and Moto Guzzi settings).

Thanks,

Andrew...
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who



Joined: 10 Nov 2010
Posts: 297
Location: Melbourne Australia

PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 8:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, we all hate a good old off topic thread hijack. And you are right to demand answers.

As far as I'm aware the fuel injected YB4-6 shared a different ECU to the YB8's.

The YB4-6 ECU is the same as the 851 etc of the same era. And I believe it was Bimota's most successful fuel injection project.

I think you are on the road to becoming a Bimota fuel injection expert, because obviously Bimota didn't know too much about it Rolling Eyes

Keep us posted Very Happy
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laminator



Joined: 27 Oct 2007
Posts: 293
Location: Midlands

PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 10:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have got a YB4, I can have a look at components, voltages, etc if it will help. It was purchased in '88 and its been with our family from new, so I know it has all original parts.

I also have a copy of the manuals, etc I'll get them out and see if there is anything on the TPS.

When it wouldn't run I started investigating. My problem was that the magnets in the pickups had weakened so the ECU wasn't picking up the signal from the cam and crank.
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Bimotas, Yamaha FZR 2TK, Honda NC30, MV Agusta F3 800, Aprilia RS250
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who



Joined: 10 Nov 2010
Posts: 297
Location: Melbourne Australia

PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 1:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think advice on magnets is a good starting point, but not the answer. The plastic ecu represents a new world of pain vs the alloy clad number. I think this is why Bimota Bob opted out of his Furano. He read like a electronic engineer, but found no solace.

As I said, the Furano and the YB4-6 are different animals, at least at an electronic level, perhaps not with programming.

I engaged in a online conversation with our esteemed Bob, and when he posted a pick of the Furano ECU, I knew we were talking about different beasts.

I think Bimota made a mistake when they went to injection, but they were pioneers to the end, and ahead of their time in every respect.

What is there not to love about about the rich history of a racing company?

I think that the genius was adopted by Japan and others and in 88-90 everyone (japanese manufactures) caught up.

The genius, and the errors are what makes this company perfect.
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Andrew034



Joined: 02 Apr 2017
Posts: 13
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the help guys, every bit will help.

According to the parts manuals on Bimota Classic Parts, the YB4 and Furano share the fuel injection TPS, Sensors and Fuel Rail (with pressure regulator) but have different Injectors and ECU's.

On the Furano, the ignition and EXUP are handled by the Yamaha ECU and fuel delivery is by the Weber Marelli P7, so in effect the carburettors have been directly replaced by the P7 unit and nothing else. This allowed Bimota to upsize the throttle bodies from 36mm with carburettors to 46mm with Fuel Injection.

I don't have any real issue with the Webber Marelli P7 ECU it is a reliable if somewhat antiquated unit, the real problem is the stunning lack of available technical information generally available on the P7 and especially on it's adaptation to the Bimota installation.

For example if I could see the TPS position as the ECU sees is (in degrees of movement) then I'd know how to set the TPS but so far I can't find any software that will access the P7.

I did send a message to BimotaBob to see what he knows, but to date I haven't received a response.

What ECU is fitted to the YB4 and YB6?

NB: I'm OK with both mechanical stuff and electronics - a combination of being a former Mechanic and present Engineer combined with endless curiosity on how every thing works.
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