Bimota Forum Forum Index Bimota Forum
Forum for Bimota Owners and Riders
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in  

Li-ion batteries
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Bimota Forum Forum Index -> Bimota Chat
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
barnmankit



Joined: 23 Nov 2014
Posts: 81
Location: Pyrenees, France

PostPosted: Fri Jul 28, 2017 11:05 am    Post subject: Li-ion batteries Reply with quote

Looking for recommendations for a Li-ion battery for the DB2. Specifically best quality and value for money (and sources); also are they simply plug and play with no changes necessary to the charging circuit?
Anyone with experience of this on Bimota or other makes I'd be happy to hear from you.
Thanks in advance, Kit
_________________
1998 Bimota DB2 edizione finale naked
1976 BMW R75/6 tractor
Challenge Seiran recumbent bicycle
Numerous other bicycles

"We're each given one small grain of madness - if we lose it, we're nothing." Robin Williams
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Jonny B Bad



Joined: 05 Dec 2009
Posts: 388
Location: NE London

PostPosted: Fri Jul 28, 2017 12:16 pm    Post subject: Li-ion batteries Reply with quote

I've used Ballistic Li-ion for must be 10 years now and I'm very happy with them - don't suffer in the heat, like the absorbed glass mat batteries that I used to use and in the cold they just get stronger with each press of the starter. The ones I run are charged with a charger which balances the four packs of cells until they each show 3.60 volts. If one cell becomes more discharged than others, on a cumulative basis it can kill the battery. I don't know whether Ballistic still have the diagnostic plug on top that allows you to balance charge, as I've not needed to buy a new one for quite some years. In theory an 8 cell (i.e. 4 x 2) is fine for an inline four, but a twin will benefit from a 12 cell (i.e. 4 x 3), which will also be better for cold winter's days on an inline four. In summary, weighs next to nothing, no appreciable self-discharge, strong as an ox, brilliant. But technology comes at a cost, so don't expect lead-acid prices. If there's a downside its that if it does discharge below I think it's 9 volts it's dead - there's no bringing it back to life like a lead-acid.
_________________
What, Jonny's gone!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
barnmankit



Joined: 23 Nov 2014
Posts: 81
Location: Pyrenees, France

PostPosted: Fri Jul 28, 2017 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the info Jonny. Where do you get the Ballistic cells, and are they packaged with the right terminals to connect straight up? Are you saying that the bike's charging system isn't capable of keeping all the cells balanced?
_________________
1998 Bimota DB2 edizione finale naked
1976 BMW R75/6 tractor
Challenge Seiran recumbent bicycle
Numerous other bicycles

"We're each given one small grain of madness - if we lose it, we're nothing." Robin Williams
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
brian



Joined: 22 Aug 2011
Posts: 2620
Location: QLD, Australia

PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2017 1:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I haven't fitted a lithium battery to my Bimotas yet but I will in the future. I run a SSB lithium battery in my race bike and am very happy with it.

They say that if you run them dead flat that they will not recover, but I,Ve accidentally run my SSB lithium battery dead flat and it charged up again ok.
_________________
Current motorcycles - '99 Bimota DB4, '96 Bimota SB6, '08 VTX1800, '93 ZXR750R M1, '95 ZXR750, '95 ZXR750 Race Bike, 94 CBR400rr NC29 Race Bike, '94 CB250, '49 BSA C10 250, 61 BSA A10 650
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Jonny B Bad



Joined: 05 Dec 2009
Posts: 388
Location: NE London

PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2017 3:14 pm    Post subject: Li-ion batteries Reply with quote

Have a look at www.racecarbattery.co.uk

The sticker price is probably cheaper on one from the US via the Bay, but there won't be much difference by the time you've paid the duty.

Terminals are plug & play and you can choose which way round you want them.

The bike's charging system will charge it fine, but the makers suggest that an occasional (every few months) balance charge will prolong life - and given the cost you will likely want to do that. I know people who have run them for 4/5 years without ever balance charging. I do balance charge and I have not had one fail yet in quite a few years more than that.

I have tried to bring one back from the dead, but without success. Brian, perhaps your's was dead flat for running anything, but still above 9 volts, or what ever the threshold is. Alternatively, you may have magical powers - in which case could you help me fill in my lottery ticket
Very Happy Very Happy
_________________
What, Jonny's gone!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
barnmankit



Joined: 23 Nov 2014
Posts: 81
Location: Pyrenees, France

PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2017 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you Jonny and Brian for your replies. It's definitely on my shopping list and must be the cheapest way to save 3 or 4 kg, other than ditching the fairing, which I've already done Shocked
DB2 now coming up to 21k miles and running great. She always gives 50 - 65 mpg with the Keihin Flatslides and that's not hanging around. Uses a bit of oil - valve guides I guess - but not enough to worry about. A brilliant bike for real-world riding and the soundtrack with carbon tailpipes is awesome.
Enjoy your summer (winter) everyone.
_________________
1998 Bimota DB2 edizione finale naked
1976 BMW R75/6 tractor
Challenge Seiran recumbent bicycle
Numerous other bicycles

"We're each given one small grain of madness - if we lose it, we're nothing." Robin Williams
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
brian



Joined: 22 Aug 2011
Posts: 2620
Location: QLD, Australia

PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 9:11 am    Post subject: Re: Li-ion batteries Reply with quote

Jonny B Bad wrote:


I have tried to bring one back from the dead, but without success. Brian, perhaps your's was dead flat for running anything, but still above 9 volts, or what ever the threshold is. Alternatively, you may have magical powers - in which case could you help me fill in my lottery ticket
Very Happy Very Happy


You may be right about the 9v Jonny, hard to say. I didn't put a meter on to check, I was in too much of a hurry to get a charger on it Laughing
_________________
Current motorcycles - '99 Bimota DB4, '96 Bimota SB6, '08 VTX1800, '93 ZXR750R M1, '95 ZXR750, '95 ZXR750 Race Bike, 94 CBR400rr NC29 Race Bike, '94 CB250, '49 BSA C10 250, 61 BSA A10 650
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
vort28



Joined: 22 Mar 2010
Posts: 1855
Location: Northwest , UK

PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 8:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have Shorai lithium on a few of my Bimota's.
I bought a few so although they will charge with normal charger I got a Shorai one just for piece of mind. I have found that that will bring them back to life if they get a bit low, but like all batteries they will drain if the bike has an alarm etc , and to be honest they don't seem as tolerant to this as a normal battery.
They are light though , so swings and roundabouts really.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
who



Joined: 10 Nov 2010
Posts: 343
Location: Melbourne Australia

PostPosted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 9:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like Jonny use ballistic batteries. They are light (under a KG) and have an inbuilt charging circuit that allows up to 20 amps input, with an internal cutout. So once charge reaches the factory determined voltage the battery cuts the the charger (or alternator) out of the circuit.

They are a sort of odd shape, but you can use the packaging foam they arrive in to fettle the fitment.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
quikduk



Joined: 13 Aug 2016
Posts: 169
Location: Southern California, USA

PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2017 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have an EarthX in my DB6 courtesy of the prior owner.

http://earthxbatteries.com/shop/ETX18B

I keep it on a charger/maintainer 24/7. It seems to work fine although I will be changing out the starter circuit wires either with home-made version or with mfr. version from Motolectric to aid in removing stress from the starter sprag assembly.

http://motolectric.com/makes/ducati.html

I may also eventually change out the failure-prone Ducati regulator/rectifier to a full MOSFET type.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Bud977



Joined: 03 Mar 2013
Posts: 364
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2017 9:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I use the SSB Powersports lithium batteries. I find there is no need to trickle charge them. I go back to one of the race bikes a year later and it still starts off the starter motor like it was charger yesterday.

I use an ordinary Aldi charger to charge the battery in the total loss bike. It can be charged by your normal charging circuit on board the bike so no reason an ordinary charger can't do the job. In fact, SSB advertises that their batteries are designed to be charged with an ordinary charger.

The only thing that worries me about lithium batteries is the potential for a fire. A faulty charging circuit can overcharge the battery and start the fire and chemical reaction in the lithium. I'd want to make sure the charging circuit is good before installing a lithium. Particularly on a Bimota where the battery is hidden deep inside the bike and is not easily accessed in case of a fire.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
brian



Joined: 22 Aug 2011
Posts: 2620
Location: QLD, Australia

PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2017 11:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bud977 wrote:
I'd want to make sure the charging circuit is good before installing a lithium. Particularly on a Bimota where the battery is hidden deep inside the bike and is not easily accessed in case of a fire.


That's good advice Bud! I can't think of too many things that would be more painful than standing on the side of the road watching your Bimota burn to the ground Crying or Very sad. Or in the shed watching all of your bikes burn Shocked
_________________
Current motorcycles - '99 Bimota DB4, '96 Bimota SB6, '08 VTX1800, '93 ZXR750R M1, '95 ZXR750, '95 ZXR750 Race Bike, 94 CBR400rr NC29 Race Bike, '94 CB250, '49 BSA C10 250, 61 BSA A10 650
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
who



Joined: 10 Nov 2010
Posts: 343
Location: Melbourne Australia

PostPosted: Sat Aug 05, 2017 10:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is no evidence that any of the above mentioned batteries are prone to fault or fire... Anyone?

They are the best thing since sliced bread, and lighter than a loaf.

Don't allow the obviously poorly designed Samsung phone, or the odd reported laptop's battery fire to persuade you into a fear response.

The old style lead acid batteries vent hydrochloric acid vapour into around your motorcycle, that's why your RD400 seat base is rusted out (or my 12 are). I wouldn't be surprised if the sealed gel batteries have vent as well.

For the time being, I'll leave my 6 Ballistic batteries where they are.

Just buy a c-tech or the like charger, though I use old school 8-10 amp automotive chargers that reduce charge input as voltage increases.

In the next 10 years, there will be no lead acid batteries, and the bike you ride daily will be electric.

If you don't have change in your heart, you will be left behind... Sure the odd electric bike will catch fire as the technological revolution moves forward... Shocked Progress I say.... lol
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Bud977



Joined: 03 Mar 2013
Posts: 364
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Sat Aug 05, 2017 10:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lithium batteries can set on fire if overcharged but the modern lithiums are very safe.

They do not contain pure lithium as they once did so you won't get the chemical reaction fire. You can put them out with water.

A few years ago, I saw a one day old lithium battery on a FZR400 race bike go up in smoke. Luckily he had easy access and put it out quickly.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Bud977



Joined: 03 Mar 2013
Posts: 364
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Sat Aug 05, 2017 10:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm a fan of the lithiums. I've got them in my YB8 and VFR400 race bikes and my KTM300EXC dirt bike. Never had a problem. Even the electric start on the KTM now works!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Bimota Forum Forum Index -> Bimota Chat All times are GMT + 1 Hour
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group

The Bimota Forum has no official connection to Bimota S.p.A.. We just ride or are interested in their motorcycles and support the brand. All trademarks are acknowledged