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welshlamb
Joined: 09 Mar 2011 Posts: 592 Location: South Wales , Nr. Abergavenny
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Posted: Tue May 26, 2020 3:20 pm Post subject: DB2J parts list |
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Hi folks.
Was there ever a separate spare parts list for DB2J?
Apart from engine and paint the main changes I can see would be the rear wheel and front disc arrangements. Interested to see if part nos are the same for rear wheel spacers across all variants.
ie long (nearest wheel) 5022811020
short (nearest swinging arm) 5022811030
I can find parts list for DB2 (HF and FF), SR and FE models but not DB2J. Anyone able to shed light on this?? _________________ Not as many bikes as I would like and already too many to keep up with! |
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2bims
Joined: 03 Apr 2010 Posts: 7289
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Posted: Tue May 26, 2020 10:16 pm Post subject: |
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Well...Bimota are famed for always reinventing the wheel....so I wouldn't be surprised if there was.....albeit maybe it was only in Japanese....I would say that the frame and swingarm are the same....and given that the bimota branded wheels made by Oscam were built for bimota...that the hub would be the same even if the rim width was different....but....crunch with all DB2's...Vdues....DB4 etc...is chain alignment.....and for that it seems that the frame to engine spacers are where they tweaked tolerances and gaps to ensure correct chain alignment with the rear sprocket...generally....you would centre the front wheel....then align the back wheel...then centre the front sprocket to the back one...hence bespoke Bimota front sprockets.....but theres engine to frame spacers also
I always thought that the Juniors....like the Ducati F3's were only for the Japanese market but apparently not so....they just didn't sell well anywhere else...but did in Japan...where the "license" they had to pay for a 900cc model was only for the rich boys....but baby 400's were more affordable re license to ride...hence the "grey imports for the in line 4 400's...CBr...VFR...ZXR...FZR...etc |
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brian
Joined: 22 Aug 2011 Posts: 3769 Location: Australia
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Posted: Tue May 26, 2020 10:54 pm Post subject: |
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Since becoming a DB2 Junior owner, I’ve wondered the same. The BCP website does have the Junior in their list of parts manuals, but when you click on it, the same DB2 manual comes up.... with nothing specific to the Junior.
My rear wheel spacers are as follows.....
_________________ '99 DB4 #104, '96 SB6 #1165, '94 DB2 J #652, '99 DB4 #088, '08 VTX1800, '93 ZXR750R M1, '95 ZXR750, '95 ZXR750 Race Bike, '94 CBR400rr NC29 Race Bike, '94 CB250, '49 BSA C10 250, '61 BSA A10 650, '89 ZXR750, '91 Ducati 851 |
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brian
Joined: 22 Aug 2011 Posts: 3769 Location: Australia
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Posted: Tue May 26, 2020 11:06 pm Post subject: |
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I’d also be interested to get a hold of a workshop manual for the engine. I’m still not 100% sure what bike the engine is out of, but I’m pretty sure it’s from the 91 - 98 400SS. I tried my local (when I say local I mean 1000 klm away) Ducati dealer, but he said that he would need a VIN rather than an engine number to identify the engine. _________________ '99 DB4 #104, '96 SB6 #1165, '94 DB2 J #652, '99 DB4 #088, '08 VTX1800, '93 ZXR750R M1, '95 ZXR750, '95 ZXR750 Race Bike, '94 CBR400rr NC29 Race Bike, '94 CB250, '49 BSA C10 250, '61 BSA A10 650, '89 ZXR750, '91 Ducati 851 |
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welshlamb
Joined: 09 Mar 2011 Posts: 592 Location: South Wales , Nr. Abergavenny
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Posted: Tue May 26, 2020 11:55 pm Post subject: |
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Have been thinking about this. ....all the LH spacers seem to be 15mm on my and Brian's bikes. Given that swing arms are the same and the eccentrics are a fixed point then chain alignment must be determined by that spacer and common to all the bikes.
Then the other two spacers (provided hub width is the same?) should only effect the rear brake/disc alignment?
Will post up my measurements tomorrow. Could be that I have mixed up some parts but pretty sure not so. _________________ Not as many bikes as I would like and already too many to keep up with! |
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brian
Joined: 22 Aug 2011 Posts: 3769 Location: Australia
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Posted: Wed May 27, 2020 7:45 am Post subject: |
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welshlamb wrote: |
Have been thinking about this. ....all the LH spacers seem to be 15mm on my and Brian's bikes. Given that swing arms are the same and the eccentrics are a fixed point then chain alignment must be determined by that spacer and common to all the bikes.
Then the other two spacers (provided hub width is the same?) should only effect the rear brake/disc alignment?
Will post up my measurements tomorrow. Could be that I have mixed up some parts but pretty sure not so. |
I have another rear wheel spacer that came in a Centrepoint ‘mixed bag of lollies’that I bought a while ago. I was wanting the shock remote res bracket that was in the mixed bag but they wouldn’t separate, so I bought the lot. It’s meant to be a DB2 spacer, so I’ll measure it and report back 👍 _________________ '99 DB4 #104, '96 SB6 #1165, '94 DB2 J #652, '99 DB4 #088, '08 VTX1800, '93 ZXR750R M1, '95 ZXR750, '95 ZXR750 Race Bike, '94 CBR400rr NC29 Race Bike, '94 CB250, '49 BSA C10 250, '61 BSA A10 650, '89 ZXR750, '91 Ducati 851 |
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2bims
Joined: 03 Apr 2010 Posts: 7289
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Posted: Wed May 27, 2020 8:34 am Post subject: |
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welshlamb wrote: |
Have been thinking about this. ....all the LH spacers seem to be 15mm on my and Brian's bikes. Given that swing arms are the same and the eccentrics are a fixed point then chain alignment must be determined by that spacer and common to all the bikes.
Then the other two spacers (provided hub width is the same?) should only effect the rear brake/disc alignment?
Will post up my measurements tomorrow. Could be that I have mixed up some parts but pretty sure not so. |
Re-read my comments above Lambie......spacers on back aren't for chain alignment.....Front forks and wheel in them is centrered…...then the back wheel is set in line with the front wheel....with spacers.....then either the front sprocket is designed to align with the rear sprocket.....combined with spacers for the engine to frame point....if you "fiddled" around with the rear spacers to align the chain to front sprocket...it would fook up the wheel alignment...and also the rear shock alignment from the swinger to the frame.... |
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2bims
Joined: 03 Apr 2010 Posts: 7289
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Posted: Wed May 27, 2020 8:47 am Post subject: |
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Brians Got the spacers set up correctly in his picture....you have to look and analyse where they "bind" up when fitted.....on the inner face of the bearings in the cush drive and RHS wheel......so that it all locks together when tightened and spins freely.....orientation of the spacers is critical to not foobarring your bearings |
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hindsight
Joined: 13 Feb 2010 Posts: 126 Location: Central Scotland
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Posted: Wed May 27, 2020 10:31 am Post subject: |
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brian wrote: |
I’d also be interested to get a hold of a workshop manual for the engine. I’m still not 100% sure what bike the engine is out of, but I’m pretty sure it’s from the 91 - 98 400SS. I tried my local (when I say local I mean 1000 klm away) Ducati dealer, but he said that he would need a VIN rather than an engine number to identify the engine. |
What's the engine number Brian? |
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brian
Joined: 22 Aug 2011 Posts: 3769 Location: Australia
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Posted: Wed May 27, 2020 10:56 am Post subject: |
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hindsight wrote: |
brian wrote: |
I’d also be interested to get a hold of a workshop manual for the engine. I’m still not 100% sure what bike the engine is out of, but I’m pretty sure it’s from the 91 - 98 400SS. I tried my local (when I say local I mean 1000 klm away) Ducati dealer, but he said that he would need a VIN rather than an engine number to identify the engine. |
What's the engine number Brian? |
ZDM400A20*001657* _________________ '99 DB4 #104, '96 SB6 #1165, '94 DB2 J #652, '99 DB4 #088, '08 VTX1800, '93 ZXR750R M1, '95 ZXR750, '95 ZXR750 Race Bike, '94 CBR400rr NC29 Race Bike, '94 CB250, '49 BSA C10 250, '61 BSA A10 650, '89 ZXR750, '91 Ducati 851 |
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hindsight
Joined: 13 Feb 2010 Posts: 126 Location: Central Scotland
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Posted: Wed May 27, 2020 12:59 pm Post subject: |
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That's an interesting number Brian - I always thought these engines decoded as follows:
Z = Italy
DM = Ducati Meccanica
400= 400cc
A = Air Cooled
2 = 2V
C = Carburettor
.. then the sequential number. I wonder what the A20 in yours signifies (noting that my DB2 also has a "A2C" identifier).
Unfortunately Falloon's "Standard Catalogue of Ducati Motorcycles" books omits the 400SS engine number format, but it does show about 2800 of those bikes being built between '89 and '97 (not counting the 400M figures).
Mike |
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brian
Joined: 22 Aug 2011 Posts: 3769 Location: Australia
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Posted: Wed May 27, 2020 1:14 pm Post subject: |
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hindsight wrote: |
That's an interesting number Brian - I always thought these engines decoded as follows:
Z = Italy
DM = Ducati Meccanica
400= 400cc
A = Air Cooled
2 = 2V
C = Carburettor
.. then the sequential number. I wonder what the A20 in yours signifies (noting that my DB2 also has a "A2C" identifier).
Unfortunately Falloon's "Standard Catalogue of Ducati Motorcycles" books omits the 400SS engine number format, but it does show about 2800 of those bikes being built between '89 and '97 (not counting the 400M figures).
Mike |
Oops, I checked again and mine IS actually A2C Mike, my mistake. From photos that I’ve seen (only on google images etc) my engine doesn’t look like the earlier Ducati 400SS Junior engine. But the only photos I’ve seen of the 91-98 400SS, it looks like the engine cases are black, but mine are silver.
_________________ '99 DB4 #104, '96 SB6 #1165, '94 DB2 J #652, '99 DB4 #088, '08 VTX1800, '93 ZXR750R M1, '95 ZXR750, '95 ZXR750 Race Bike, '94 CBR400rr NC29 Race Bike, '94 CB250, '49 BSA C10 250, '61 BSA A10 650, '89 ZXR750, '91 Ducati 851 |
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hindsight
Joined: 13 Feb 2010 Posts: 126 Location: Central Scotland
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Posted: Wed May 27, 2020 1:19 pm Post subject: |
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Ah - so that photo looks to me to be exactly what I expected, with a "C" as the ninth character, rather than "0"
ZDM400A2C
That therefore puts it exactly where I would expect for a 400SS engine somewhere around about 1992-93, if the figures in the book are accurate.
The earlier 400SSJ had a different engine number entirely according to Falloon (ZDM400L). |
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brian
Joined: 22 Aug 2011 Posts: 3769 Location: Australia
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Posted: Wed May 27, 2020 1:23 pm Post subject: |
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hindsight wrote: |
Ah - so that photo looks to me to be exactly what I expected, with a "C" as the ninth character, rather than "0"
ZDM400A2C
That therefore puts it exactly where I would expect for a 400SS engine somewhere around about 1992-93, if the figures in the book are accurate.
The earlier 400SSJ had a different engine number entirely according to Falloon (ZDM400L). |
Yep my mistake Mike, old eyes looking at a small screen 😂 _________________ '99 DB4 #104, '96 SB6 #1165, '94 DB2 J #652, '99 DB4 #088, '08 VTX1800, '93 ZXR750R M1, '95 ZXR750, '95 ZXR750 Race Bike, '94 CBR400rr NC29 Race Bike, '94 CB250, '49 BSA C10 250, '61 BSA A10 650, '89 ZXR750, '91 Ducati 851 |
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welshlamb
Joined: 09 Mar 2011 Posts: 592 Location: South Wales , Nr. Abergavenny
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Posted: Wed May 27, 2020 4:40 pm Post subject: |
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2bims wrote: |
Brians Got the spacers set up correctly in his picture....you have to look and analyse where they "bind" up when fitted.....on the inner face of the bearings in the cush drive and RHS wheel......so that it all locks together when tightened and spins freely.....orientation of the spacers is critical to not foobarring your bearings |
1) but all the exile spacers should be the same length between bikes yes? If not why a single part number??
2) the rhs spacer on my bikes (including the supposedly complete/ as built example is facing the other way Ie broad face towards the calliper bracket.
Will see if I have any photos of me earlier DB2 _________________ Not as many bikes as I would like and already too many to keep up with! |
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